i mean, it is really incredible. what does this mean for the fiscal cliff discussions? >> well, i don't think it really means a whole lot. i think it is -- sort of the white house's way, treasurer's way, of putting extra pressure on the people in the building behind us. by the way, none of them are there. i'm not sure that's really going to work, frankly. and -- i -- john, our colleague john harwood is exactly right. this is not a surprise. we knew this was coming. the question that it is, you know, three days -- thee business days, as you say before, the actual deadline itself, that's disconcerting. but -- again, it is not surprising. i don't think it has any -- will peak the negotiations at all, frankly. not at all. >> what about the secretary's use of this phrase -- the country would otherwise default on its legal obligations. i think he purposefully use this phrase default to confuse the public and -- during the last debt ceiling debate we had the same confusion as if the u.s. government would not pay interest on its debts.